---

A Conversation about
Turning Points 2000
with its co-authors

Over several days in January 2001, MiddleWeb listserv members had the opportunity to discuss the recently published Turning Points 2000: Educating Adolescents in the 21st Century, with several "visits" by authors Gayle Davis and Tony Jackson.

Here's a transcript of the conversation. For more information about the book, and a link to an excerpt, see the references in the first message..

Hi, folks!

Welcome to our first "Booklist" conversation. Here's the reference to the background info again.

Gayle Davis and Tony Jackson will join us soon. Meanwhile, feel free to post any comments, summary statements, or questions to the list.

John Norton
Listserv Manager


Some Background:

Here is a page at MiddleWeb with a brief summary of Turning Points 2000, ordering information, and links to other TP2000 information on the Web.

http://www.middleweb.com/MWLresources/turningpts.html

A Turning Points Excerpt:

Our thanks to Holly Holland and Kelly Mazzoli, editors of NMSA's Middle Ground, for allowing us to post this excerpt from Turning Points 2000, which appeared in the October 2000 issue.

This excerpt, with an introduction by the authors, draws on the chapter highlighting curriculum and assessment, the first of seven key elements in the design system described in Turning Points 2000. Includes a sidebar, "Backward Design: Putting Standards into the Curriculum" and a section titled, "Multiple Forms of Assessment at Camels Hump Middle School."

http://www.middleweb.com/MWLresources/tp2000excrpt.html

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The conversation began when middle grades teacher Bill Ivey wrote:

First, I want to thank Gayle Davis and Tony Jackson very much for agreeing to participate in this discussion. I am very much looking forward to it, as both "Turning Points 2000" with its holistic design, and Middleweb, with its professional and supportive community, have contributed more to my professional life this year than has happened in the past few years cumulatively.

I am in my first year teaching middle grades students (grades 6-9), following 15 years at an all-girls boarding high school. Despite my M.A.T. in French and my years of teaching experience, I found the initial transition to middle grades teaching much more difficult than I had expected, and I hadn't expected it to be easy. This certainly would support your contention that middle grades teachers need preparation specific to this age group!

Now that I am getting settled in, I can see my way clear to the kind of seamless, non-stop professional development to which you refer in your book; fortunately, my school's professional development design lends itself well to this approach. But, I'm thinking, there have to be ways to ease the transition!

I picked up on the Savario Mungo quote "that prospective middle level teachers must immerse themselves within that culture to understand it" (p.101) as that is a process I tried to begin over the summer. I joined NMSA, read "Our Last Best Chance" by Laura Sessions Steps, subscribed to the MIDDLE-L listserv (this was pre-Middleweb), and surfed the web in an effort to begin to learn something of the developmental needs of young adolescents and the culture of middle schools.

I was wondering, regarding adolescent development, what books and other sources you would suggest, and what activities, to a teacher making the transition to middle grades education.

I'll look forward to checking in on this discussion tomorrow evening when I'm back home with my beloved iMac. Enjoy the day!

Thanks again,

Bill Ivey
Pine Cobble School
Williamstown, MA

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Gayle A. Davis (co-author of "Turning Points 2000" and Director of the Educational Policy Reform Research Institute, University of Maryland, College Park) wrote:

First, I want to thank John Norton for organizing this discussion of "Turning Points 2000." It should be interesting to hear from folks who've read the book that Tony Jackson and I spent so long researching and writing.

Now, as to the first questions from Bill Ivey: "I was wondering, regarding adolescent development, what books and other sources you would suggest, and what activities, to a teacher making the transition to middle grades education."

I have one overarching recommendation for you regarding identifying resources to review. In the March 1997 issue of "Phi Delta Kappan," early adolescent and information services expert Susan Rosenzweig has an article called "The Five-Foot Bookshelf: Readings on Middle Level Education and Reform" (Volume78, Number 7, pp. 551-556). It's the best list I've seen of resources containing critical information on middle grades education.

I'll highlight a few key resources that appear on the list. First, "This We Believe: Developmentally Responsive Middle Schools," was published by the National Middle School Association (NMSA) in 1995 as a revision of the original version that came out in 1982. It's a great, and concise, overview of the best education for early adolescents, and stands alongside "Turning Points: Preparing American Youth for the 21st Century" (Carnegie Council on Adolescent Development, 1989) and "Turning Points 2000" as a benchmark document in the field.

Second, in regard to middle level teacher preparation specifically, I recommend NMSA's 1997 publication, "NMSA/NCATE-Approved Curriculum Guidelines Handbook," which outlines a framework for the preparation of middle level teachers. I believe the handbook is currently being revised, but the 1997 version is still a wonderful source of information and food for thought.

Third, in regard to professional development, you might want to look at the National Staff Development Council's 1995 publication, "Standards for Staff Development: Middle Level Edition," 2nd edition. This document is also currently under revision.

Finally, I'd point you to the web site for the National Forum to Accelerate Middle Grades Reform. The site has lots of great links, and the members of the Forum include key experts in many areas of middle grades education.

The vision statement of the Forum, in particular, concisely describes what middle grades education should be, and is something that Tony and I endorse in the first chapter of "Turning Points 2000." You obviously are already familiar with another great web site, MiddleWeb, the host of this discussion.

As for activities for a teacher making the transition to the middle grades, chapter 5 in "Turning Points 2000" describes the notion of "induction," the idea of introducing teachers new to the middle grades to the culture of the middle grades generally, and their school's and team's culture in particular.

It's common to think that teachers straight out of an undergraduate or master's certification program, brand new to the classroom, need mentoring. What we point out is that teachers who aren't new to teaching but who are new to the middle grades also need support as they gain familiarity with young adolescents, middle grades curriculum, assessment, and instruction, organization, governance, parent and community involvement issues, etc.

On an informal level, contact with young adolescents (e.g., tutoring, volunteering in classrooms) and contact with their teachers can be helpful in getting a more insider view of the middle grades. Obviously, we also recommend field experiences in middle grades schools are crucial to preparation for teaching in middle grades schools and to gaining certification and licensure for teaching young adolescents.

I hope all that's helpful and good luck.

Gayle Davis

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Amy Heinsma wrote:

Wow! I am in the middle of reading and taking notes and reflecting. The biggest thing that has been verified for me by reading this is the amount of time that teachers need to have (or take) to dissect their own teaching and learning, to discuss deeply the work of our students and ourselves, and to develop plans and curriculum ( the three D's) and really address what's going on in the classroom.

Unfortunately, this time is not given to us at the moment. I have been sending e-mails and articles to our principal about doing things of this nature, but our inservice and planning time seems to be filled with meetings of an hour or two where we are supposed to get into deep dialogue, (not enough time over time!) or "programs" that will fit our every need. We are not taking the time to process what we are really doing and/or about.

It seems my staff is tired, overwhelmed, and afraid to talk about the learning going on in classrooms. How do you suggest re-energizing a staff to really work hard and dig deep without the moaning of "one more thing to do"? Any thoughts out there? Thanks.

Amy Heinsma
7th Language Arts & Reading
Windsor, Colorado

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Marsha Ratzel responded:

Amy,

I totally agree with you. I intellectually understand that change has to come in small doses when people are ready. I don't understand, though, how to help bring about a climate of readiness. I'd be interested to hear how others were able to do that.

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Ellen Berg responded to Amy:

Amy Heinsma wrote: "The biggest thing that has been verified for me by reading this is the amount of time that teachers need to have (or take) to dissect their own teaching and learning, to discuss deeply the work of our students and ourselves, and to develop plans and curriculum ( the three D's) and really address what's going on in the classroom."

Amy,

I feel the same way. Although personal reflection is intensely necessary and helpful, I have found a need to talk about what I'm thinking and learning with colleagues. Unfortunately, much of this talk is on the sidewalk during bus duty, a few emails passed each week, or 15-20 minutes of the monthly faculty meeting. Our meetings are packed with "business" talk (walking students to lunch, being on time to duty, etc.) instead of focused talk on improving the education of children.

I wonder how this can change if the leadership does not see the value in it. I am fortunate because I have the support and conversation of the listserv. However, what happens to all the teachers in isolation? At what point do they quit the profession or become disinterested in professional dialogue? Many teachers in my school have shut down to anyone quoting research or giving an inservice whether it is beneficial or not. How do we change this in our schools?

Ellen Berg
Turner MEGA Magnet Middle
St. Louis, MO

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Ellen followed up with a more general message about moving from the ideal "picture" presented in Turning Points 2000 to the actual practice.

Hi all!

No one who has read "Turning Points 2000" can disagree with the recommendations within. The book contains the picture of the idealistic program for adolescents. However, as much as I agree with it all, I wonder how we move from the picture to the practice.

Ideally (there's that word again!) we would have teachers, buildings, districts, and politicians who were committed to middle level education. However, we all have been in situations and worked with people who are not as interested in the education of adolescents as they are in collecting a paycheck or taking the easy way out.

We talk a lot about changing or influencing the hearts and minds of our children, but how do we do that with our coworkers, superiors, and school districts? How do we actually put this into practice on a large scale?

I am able with a few of my colleagues to create (or, at least, ever work towards) an ideal middle level classroom, but I wonder what, if any, long term effects it will have on the students I teach.

What are your thoughts on this issue?

Ellen Berg

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Mary Anne Kosmoski replied:

Ellen-- I agree whole heartedly! when I was first introduced to the middle level concept--back in oh--1989. Carnegie had just come out with the original Turning Points report. My new principal was on the cutting edge and she wanted her school to look just like it did in the text.

What she failed to realize was that to cover five classes for team planning time meant you needed at least six elective teachers for two periods--so that in the course of a day each could get a planning period. The district didn't quite agree, but let her do it for a year. Then the funding was cut.

This year we re-introduced the idea of Advisor/Advisee, but no extra funding was allotted to it so the creation of the curriculum fell on already tired teachers who now do silent sustained reading in Advisory 60% of the time.

In a quick poll of middle level admin across the district only about 60% can afford to group teachers on teams and give them common planning time at least 3 times a week. We are lucky--our four member teams can plan together every day. Our two-man teams in sixth grade, plan together four days.

Turning Points 2000 inspired me to take some action though. Why not write a grant to fund an Advisory Program (all I have to do is find one that fits)? Any one know of an RFP that's out there? We are seriously looking at a block schedule--if we do that can we free one teacher to teach an extra elective so reading teachers can plan with core teams?

Maybe a bookstore would be willing to be a business partner and donate the magazines they have left over at the end of the month? now, if I could just find a 36 hour day.

Mary Anne

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Deb Bambino, a teacher turned staff developer in Philadelphia, wrote:

Hi Amy, Ellen et al,

Having administrative support is a big bonus, but empowering ourselves by requesting structured time at planning meetings and faculty meetings is a start. If you are willing to learn about, essential questions, collaborative inquiry and the use of protocols, and are willing to present your learnings at staff meetings, I can't imagine an administrator, who would turn you down.

If you can get one team or small learning community to pilot some regularized, reflective work...things will begin to change and others will notice.

If you're anything like me, you want it all to change and change quickly, but we know it doesn't happen that way. Start small and try sharing some of the same tools with your students. My kids really got into the activities, like Chalk Talk, Planning Backwards, Refining their Questions etc., that I shared with them.

I would share the research on page 131 about planning time and its impact on improved test scores (see Mertens et al.,1998) to make my case with both colleagues and my administrator.

Deb

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Then Deb followed up on Mary Anne's specific comments:

Mary Anne,

I like the way you are thinking outside the box! I know some folks in Seattle, who are starting the student day two hours late twice a month, to make time for teacher planning.

Does your District require student service projects? I'm wondering if kids could get involved in internships that might also create some roster space...

I also think meaningful parental engagement is key in the fight for planning time. It all comes down to priorities and funding. If parents were part of the conversation and saw that planning meant better teaching, as opposed to people wanting more "free" time, we could organize effectively.

Parents are turning to vouchers out of a sense of powerlessness and we are partly to blame. Turning Points is about empowerment of teachers, students and their families. We need to spread the word.

Deb

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Bill Ivey replied to several comments:

Hi!

Now that the first of 100 crepes for the 8th grade Quebec trip fundraiser are browning on the stove, I can get back to this discussion.

Thank you, Gayle, for your wonderful and detailed response to my question. It will give me lots of food for thought, and will continue to positively affect my teaching long after this discussion is over.

In answer to Betsy's question, it seems to me that building a solid team would have to go hand in hand with evaluating one's own teaching. My school is so small (only 49 students in grades 6-9, 13 teachers who work full or part time in the upper school) that we are, in effect, a team even though we don't use that terminology. The weekly give and take of faculty meetings, which typically last about an hour, enable us to focus on the social and academic needs of individual kids and confirm or revise our conceptions and practices regarding our common goals.

This leads to a common thread running through most all these postings, which is time. Time to reenergize teachers, time to put the theories into practice, time to accomplish everything we want to, time to move our schools toward the vision in "Turning Points 2000." Deb's posting arrived while I was working on this one, and her point about it's taking more time than we would want to to meet these goals yet we still have to work toward them is very well taken.

I believe each school has its own character, and some schools are more open to change than others. We can evaluate the climate of our own schools, find friends and allies (and Deb makes another good point when she suggest enlisting parents as allies), get support and do our best. But we have no control over the people around us, any more than they do over us. Perhaps this is where a well-implemented standards-based professional development program such as was outlined in "Turning Points 2000" may help, presuming adminstrators see the value.

My own school is lucky enough to have an energizing new Head, accompanied by an excellent student-focused Upper School Head, leading a faculty over 50% of whom are new to the school within the past two years into a period of self-study leading to our 10-year reaccreditation visit. Everyone I've talked to agrees the school is on a positive track, and that it must continue in this vein. What an opportunity!

When Ellen wonders what difference all this will make to the students she teaches, I understand her concern because certainly the more kids participate in an excellent middle school education, the more they get out of it. Yet some good teaching is better than none, and I don't think we can ever underestimate the possibility we are making a difference to some kid out there, perhaps when we least expect it.

Maybe that's a good note on which to end this message. I may be back later tonight (still about 25 crepes, not to mention 5 preps, to go).

Bill Ivey
French and Music Teacher
Pine Cobble School
Williamstown, MA

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John Norton raised a new issue:

"It's the 'hug 'em til they dropout' approach to middle school education."

A colleague once offered this phrase to me in explanation of the adult culture he believed he had witnessed in many middle schools.

What he meant, of course, was that he had visited many schools where teachers and principals cared deeply for their students, nurturing them through the tough years of adolescence. But, he believed, their concern (and, in some inner-city schools, their sympathy and pity) for the students' emotional needs did not extend to the future, when -- without a strong academic foundation -- they would likely fail to lead a rich adult life.

In "Turning Points 2000," Gayle and Tony challenge my colleague's position - or seem to - when they write (page 10):

"Some would argue that it is unnecessary to assert the primacy of intellectual development in middle grades education. We believe it is necessary. It is necessary because critics of middle grades schools will otherwise continue to assert -- wrongly -- that middle grades educators do not believe their students are capable of significant intellectual development or that they believe it is more important to help students successfully traverse the emotional vicissitudes inherent in this developmental stage."

Here's my question to Gayle and Tony and the group:

IS my friend wrong?

And, even if they do *believe* it, do they practice it?

Do most middle schools strike a good balance between -- as the Clark Foundation once put it -- high support, high content, and high expectations?

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Listserv member Michelle Pedigo, the 2000 NASSP middle grades principal of the year, responded to John's question:

There are many factors that should be considered around this debate. First, what kind of skills do these students COME to the middle grades with? We are finding our district that the students who come in this mode are already severely behind in reading and math skills. Sometimes, it seems that the middle school is supposed to bump them up to grade level and are condemned if they don't.

The other point is that I don't think we can argue no hugs or no academic excellence. It must be both. We must address the developmental needs of all middle grades students and expect them to meet high academic standards. Without the developmental needs being met, there will not be high academic success in most cases. On the other hand, we can't ignore the demand for academic excellence, nor do we want to!

Michelle Pedigo
Glasgow, KY

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Marsha Ratzel wrote:

This is a wonderful book. I have felt like a lone ranger so often in my building while people give lip service to these concepts and yet don't want to invest the time to carry them into action. I know that I'm too impatient and the assurance that I'm not so far off target is very reassuring.

The Backwards Design has just recently become a part of my toolbox. I was lucky to take a class on Webquest that Bernie Dodge and Tom March taught online several years ago. The book Understanding by Design helped me to begin to learn this technique. I thought the example used with Collins Middle School was absolutely inspiring. So often, I haven't understood how to apply the idea of backwards design to science and/or math.

I also thought the advice of how to get to the point of deciding on the standards would be very valuable. I would so much love a day or two or three where our faculty tried to merge all our subject requirements into essential questions. How invigorating that would be!!! Has anyone had the opportunity to do that? I'd love to hear about it.

I'm lucky to work in an awesome building and a good district, so I don't mean to complain at all. I'm thankful for my place in this world. But oh,. could we soar to new heights with some of these ideas. This is a wonderful book.

Just drooling in Kansas,

Marsha

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Mary Anne Kosmoski wrote:

Hi all-- "Start with the end in mind." This part of the text drew my immediate attention. In Florida our Sunshine State, Standards and grade level benchmarks are so vague that trying to break them down into "teachable" bits is a challenge even for seasoned teachers.

One of the hardest things for our new teachers to do do is to turn Standards into lessons. I have been struggling with the idea of creating performance tasks that teachers can do in their classrooms to make the standards real.

Many of my teachers are "teaching the novel" in the hopes of reaching the standards--and are realizing it just isn't getting the the kids to understand the concepts. I guess my question is how are others dealing with standards that are seeminly unreachable and vague? How are helping new teachers go from standards to day to day lesson planning?

Mary Anne

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Deb Bambino replied:

I have found that by involving kids in project based learning, I could both engage them in starting with the end in mind/planning backwards, and cover a number of standards simultaneously. I would begin with the desired content and then organize various lessons and activities to highlight the standards, that I was trying to cover. Sorry this is so general, but without hearing a few of the standards, it's hard to be very specific.

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California principal Betsy Burch wrote:

As usual, I will be working during this chat - but here is a question or two that I hope will contribute to the discussion.

Questions:

1. Acknowledging that co-author Tony Jackson says, "The sum is much greater than the parts!", we still need to start somewhere - so, for a non-teamed faculty, not used to regular collaboration on "how they teach", would the most effective place to start be a training in on of the models of looking at student work?

2. Or is there another more effective way to start, such as creating teacher teams and shared planning time, structurally, then moving to the student work examination training?

I have thoroughly enjoyed both the book and the background articles and plan to use it with my Action Plan Team as a starting point for the Improvement Plan we are required to create in my school.

Betsy Burch

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Turning Points co-author Gayle Davis replied:

In her message, Betsy Burch references a quote from Tony Jackson that "the sum is much greater than the parts," then goes on to ask, since "we still need to start somewhere," what to do for a "non-teamed faculty not used to regular collaboration on 'how they teach.'"

This question gets at the heart of the difficulties in any effort, like Turning Points 2000, to give guidance on what to do to improve schools. Namely, how can we give advice on what to do first, on what sequence to follow, given the recognition that every state, district, school, community, teacher, and student is different. No organization or individual is in exactly the same place as any other, given varying knowledge, experience, culture, values, expectations, etc.

The Turning Points 2000 model we describe is a design system, such that every recommendation is an element that affects, and is affected by, every other element in the system (see Chapter 2, particularly p. 25 and pp. 27-28).

Changes in teaching and learning, which Betsy seems to seek, affect, for example, relationships among teachers and between teachers and students and have implications for professional development needs. Those same teaching and learning changes are affected by school governance structures and decisions and the support, or lack thereof, from parents and the community.

Given the complexity and variation I've just described, figuring out where to start requires a careful assessment of where you are and where you want to go, then developing a clear plan for getting there. We describe how to develop such an action plan in Chapter 7, as part of a democratic school governance system.

That governance system is not for the purpose of "managing" the school, since management, no matter how efficient, does not automatically lead to improvement of the organization. Our analysis suggests that school governance is better thought of as a school-wide system for communication, planning, evaluation and accountability.

One of the really critical functions of the school governance system is to create and use a schoolwide plan for improvement -- a plan not done as a matter of compliance, rather a living document that illuminates the school's core mission and guiding principles, and drives the process of continuous improvement. It's the school's plan for getting better.

In the book, we lay out a pretty straightforward approach to developing, using, and refining a school improvement plan. The heart of the process is the systematic collection of data to illuminate a key problem in learning. These data can be both quantitative, involving standardized test scores, grades, performance based assessments, surveys, and so on, or interview, observational and other qualitative data.

What collecting these data does is put the analysis of what needs to be improved on solid ground and moves it away from speculative and anecdotal data that in many instances may represent only a vocal minority within the school community.

Once a course of action to address a key learning challenge is identified, collecting data on an ongoing basis enables the school to know if new approaches are really resulting in changes in teacher practice and student learning, and ultimately to know if the school is moving toward or away from achieving the goals it has identified.

So, in short, I cannot tell you whether to start with "training on looking at student work." Any decision about what professional development to engage teachers in must be grounded in understanding all the other elements of the system we describe - not just curriculum, assessment, and instruction, but organizing relationships for learning, governance, safe and healthy schools, and involving parents and communities.

That understanding can be gained through the process of developing a clear plan for action, a process that starts with determining where you are and what evidence you have to show that's where you are. For example, the kind of resources - time, money, and human - that high quality professional development requires likely won't be obtained with anecdotal information and guesses. It requires data, from various sources, and reflection on what those data might mean and the course of action to take.

It's just not simple, but it's definitely worth it.

Gayle Davis

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Mary Anne responded to Gayle's comment about school culture:

Gayle-- What you are suggesting here is in effect how to change the culture of a school. One of the problems that I am facing is that we have instituted weekly "curriculum meetings" specifically with the idea of moving toward looking at student work and reflective practice.

We have requested teachers develop and share lessons and talk about what goes on in classrooms. We have a few who are anxious to this and participate, focused and ontask. However, the large majority attempt to turn these into "gripe" sessions about how much they have to do.

My partner and I turned the tables on them. We are having a school wide FCAT Writes practice test. Every team will have samples of the students writing on the same writing prompt and will be able to compare writing grades 6-8. A kind of--where we are--where we are going. We are hoping that it changes some attitudes. Changing culture is really hard. I did some work last year with the folks at the Annenburg Institute. Their support has been invaluable. It seems like many of us are caught in the same struggle. We see where we want to be--and are taking baby steps toward it!

Mary Anne

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Betsy Burch responded to Gayle's reply:

Thank you Gayle,

I appreciate greatly your detailed and thoughtful answer - my site is involved in a very detailed data collection process which will tell us where we are, with lots of evidence to prove it! We will then write an Improvement Plan in collaboration with our External Evaluator as part of the California "Underperforming" schools improvement process.

I look forward to sharing your response to my questions with my Action Plan Team. I have also begun to give this group information about the Turning Points model. Thank you again for your response and the time you are taking to allow us, as listserv members, the fascinating opportunity to engage in a dialogue which will benefit all of our schools and our middle school kids!

Betsy

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Amy Heinsma wrote:

Gayle & Tony & Members of the list -

It seems to me that two of the recommendations (pages 23 - 24) end up being a "choice between" rather than choice of both when districts are budgeting their money and their time. When I saw rigorous standards and a healthy school environment, including,I assume from the description, things like P.E., counseling for kids who need it, drug & alcohol lessons, trips to the nurse, Healthy Sexuality courses, etc., it seems to me these are often in direct conflict with each other in public schools.

The one thing I wish for now is for more time (time for myself to plan more effectively and time with the kids). It seems when they are gone out of my classroom, I end up feeling very resentful that they are taken out of my class. Do you see middle schools being more of community centers, where teachers and parents and students gather outside of school hours to also do things (besides sports)? That's the sense that I got as I was reading, and I wanted to clarify and maybe get your thoughts on this.

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Naomi Smith wrote:

I am Naomi Smith, Assistant Principal at a large NYC middle school, in charge of one of our four smaller theme-based learning environments called Academies.

Our school opened as a middle school, with a wonderful principal, who had a Doctorate in Middle School Philosophy. We were immersed in Turning Points. We were encouraged to nurture our students, set up advisories for support, etc.

We were quite successful. But we did not have, nor want, rows of silent students who listened to the teacher at the front of the room, etc. Well, along came a young new male teacher who knew better then us older, nurturing women. He went to the principal to report how we "old ladies"" were coddling our students, not demanding the proper discipline. Our principal told him he would rather have a staff of old ladies hugging the kids then young men getting the kids so angry that they exploded.

You can hug kids and provide quality education, and you can march kids up and down, punish them for any infraction, and not educate at all. From what I have observed, and what I know, it is the kid who not one school adult has stopped and said "I like this kid and I am going to support her" that is most likely to drop out.

In Turning Points 2000, on page 169, data from a 1997 research study indicates that "Lower academic achievement and students' feeling of being disconnected from school are also associated with greater emotional distress, ........For middle grades students, health and learning are inextricably linked."

Naomi Smith

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Deb Bambino followed up on Naomi's comments:

Naomi wrote: "In Turning Points 2000, on page 169, data from a 1997 research study indicates that 'Lower academic achievement and students' feeling of being disconnected from school are also associated with greater emotional distress, ........For middle grades students, health and learning are inextricably linked.'"

As a 47 year old, who has just started an Ed Administration course, I'd have to say that those stresses continue well past adolescence!

Back to the kids, I just received an email from a recent graduate, who wrote to express her thanks and share her latest grade 9 scores. She's feeling successful and grateful, because a few of her middle grades' teachers took the time to support her as she entered a new, big, high school where she felt out of the loop.

My student, who I'll call "J" is bright and very hard working, but when she felt disconnected, her confidence began to slip. Supporting our kids so that they can succeed in rigorous situations is fundamental, in terms of their needs and our abilities.

Moving into a related, but slightly different area, I'd like to discuss the section of the book that deals with "adapting standards" on page 34. I like the critical approach that is advocated by the authors. While I agree that we need high standards, I'm not in agreement with the blind acceptance of standards handed down from on high.

I also think that the incorporation of student choice and voice into our curriculums can enrich a standards based approach tremendously.

I am the Teaching and Learning Network Coordinator for a cluster of twelve schools in Phila. I am responsible for instructional support and professional development activities in those twelve schools. Before taking this position, I taught grades 7 and 8 for twelve years. While I have taught all subjects, I have specialized in science for the last 6 years. I am a member of the Coalition of Essential Schools and I am a facilitator for the National School Reform Faculty.

Deb

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Naomi Smith had something else to add about "full support" middle schools:

Sorry to respond again, but I am at one of the first full service schools (not the ones described in the book, but one that Joy Dryfoos knows well.)

While many services are provided to students during the school day, it really is more helful than disruptive. For instance, a student may receive counseling once weekly, and miss one class (which teachers have already agreed upon.) The student is receiving much needed support, the teacher and student have access to the councilor when needed as well. This is very helpful.

For medical services (including Dental care and eye exams) students miss a class or two on occasion. Students with asthma know they can come to school and get a treatment when needed. The alternative is that students miss half days or entire days to see theses health professionals outside of school. The worse alternative is that they don't recieve health care at all and end up in the emergency room.

Naomi Smith
NYC

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Marsha Ratzel had this to say about balancing rigor and nurture:

I'll take the 'hug 'em part of that statement, but not the "til they drop out" part. I think the brain based-learning ideas and the multiple intelligences approaches give a whole new lease on life. When you incorporate ongoing, formative assessment into these approaches, students have a game plan that plays to their strengths on which they can demonstrate some level of success.

I think the one-on-one conferencing, even once a week for a couple of minutes, gives enough personal attention that they can hang in there and work towards a goal. Then when they achieve that goal, on their own, using their resources, you have helped them grow towards being independent.

That independence is just what the adolescents I know want. So to help them acquire academic skills and the habits of responsibility enables them to get what they want. I see that students are encouraged when they can perform at their own level, help write the assessments, and strive towards high goals. They know when you're just "being nice" and when you truly believe they've done something worthwhile.

And to include their parents in that loop---where the parents know enough about what is going on to ask the right kinds of questions at night and to help out their kids---adds a way for parents to build up their kiddos in a genuine way.

I hate fake self-esteem builders. I prefer to see kids work hard, achieve all they are capable of doing, and then feel the success of that hard work. Does that mean we'll all be A students in the grade card department? Probably not. But that's not why I care about teaching kiddos or why I am a teacher. Turning Points talks about all the pieces needed to become nuturing emotionally and intellectually.

My experience says that middle schools around me don't seem very middle of the road, they're either very nuturing or very academically oriented. Unfortunately most academically oriented schools are very traditionally organized and miss the boat for stretching their kids through empowering them. And others are so busy worrying about creating nice environments that they seem more like camps than schools. I am lucky to work at a building where a middle of the road approach is usually taken. It's unusual in this area anyway.

Sorry that I haven't given much info about myself. I've been teaching 7th grade for 3 years and 6th grade for 5 years before that. I teach in Kansas, but lived a large part of my adult life in Boston working as a statistician and in San Diego as a medical group administrator. So you can see I am newly in the teaching profession, having been a hospital administrator for 15 years before my midlife crisis (I needed a job where I could make a difference, not a profit)..

I have always taught science on 3 person teams, until this year when I'm teaching on a two-person team. I teach math and science. It is a wonderful combo and fits together so well. But I am lucky because we are using problem-solving based curriculums in both areas---Connected Math and the Jefferson County Middle School Life Science. My science training spills over into math which has become a hugely experimental math class where we try and generalize patterns we see(via the Investigations of the curriculum), hypothesize the outcomes, and then test.

I know other math teachers aren't as comfortable with that methodology, but I love it. I am also very involved in the staff development coursework in my district and teach 20-30 classes a year on integrating technology into the classroom(PowerPoint, digital photography, Internet collaboration projects, VideoFlex technology, Excel use in content areas, online photo albums, eboards, WWW, Webquests, etc.)

Hope that gives you enough background on me.

Marsha Ratzel

==================================

Ellen Berg responded in part:

Marsha Ratzel wrote: "I prefer to see kids work hard, achieve all they are capable of doing, and then feel the success of that hard work. Does that mean we'll all be A students in the grade card department? Probably not."

Why not? Aren't all students capable of mastering the material in our classes with enough focused effort and support? Capability implies ability, and I believe ability is not a fixed quantity but rather an evolving and expanding property that grows with effort and experience. Yes, it might take some students longer, but eventually all our students should be able to master the material.

This is the trouble with artificial structure like quarters, semesters, and years. That model supposes that all students learn at the same rate and each student as an individual learns at the same rate in each area of study. I have never been able to understand why we have arranged our schools in grades and quarters and the rest.

If we are truly looking to educate our students and build their esteem legitimately (as well as offer them the support they need), students should be moved along according to mastery of essential concepts. We are in the business of educating children, not moving them along at an artificial rate. What happens to the child who needs more support or time on an essential concept to fully grasp it, yet they earn a "C" and we move them along because the semester or class or school year is over?

I realize this is a difficult proposition, but there has to be a better way to ensure all our children learn what they need to learn. What do you all think?

Ellen Berg
St. Louis, MO
6th grade Communication Arts

==================================

Anne Jolly wrote to comment on several themes of Turning Points:

Gayle and Tony,

Thanks for moving away from the "core of common knowledge" terminology! Without exploring the concept beneath that phrase, many folks simply equated it with "the basics" and never moved beyond that.

I also like the backward design concept - "Start with the end in mind." I like the way you integrate assessment into a continuous cycle of teaching and learning.

However, the concept that grabs me the most is the idea of ongoing collaboration among teachers. I took a year out of the classroom in my middle school in order to establish a systematic process for teacher collaboration in my school and in one other. (We had teaming, but we teachers did not use this time productively in terms of improving our learning and our student's learning.) The faculty in my school used a model similar to Murphy's Whole-Faculty Study Groups. (See an article about Anne Jolly's collaboration here.)

In the other middle school, we set up a departmental approach to collaboration. Both models resulted in improved student performance. We explored incentives, creative use of time, and variety of ways to involve teachers.

I believe that many teachers need some sort of structured collaborative process to engage them in this unfamiliar activity (adult interaction, of all things!). What do you think, and what sort of structured collaboration, if any, would you recommend?

Anne Jolly
Science

==================================

Bill Ivey chimed in on the "hug 'em" discussion:

John Norton wrote: "It's the 'hug 'em til they dropout' approach to middle school education." A colleague once offered this phrase to me (...) Is my friend wrong? And, even if they do *believe* in balancing rigor and nurture, do they practice it?

and

Marsha Ratzel wrote: "I'll take the 'hug 'em part of that statement, but the not til they dropout part. (...) My experience says that middle schools around me don't seem very middle of the road, they're either very nurturing or very academically oriented."

Hi,

I am betting that most good middle schools are struggling with the balance of intellectual and emotional development, and that that is a healthy process. I can understand the importance of placing intellectual development first, as is asserted by Gayle and Tony in their book; after all, we are schools. But emotional development is necessary both as a context for intellectual development and for the education of "the whole person" which so many of us strive for. After all, the kids are people. I would suggest that only by understanding that intellectual and emotional development are part of a holistic process and through constant self-examination will schools serve students to their best.

That part was actually relatively easy to say. The harder question John raises is, do schools in general actually do it?

Here, I agree with Marsha, and am betting there is a whole range of responses depending on the school (though I am also betting most schools believe that they strike an appropriate balance even if others might perceive them as way out on one side or another).

In my own school this fall, we confronted head on a self-perception, reinforced by the secondary school experience our students had once they graduated, that we had become too lenient in our standards for overall grade, effort and citizenship. The entire upper school faculty agreed to recommit to such and such a "general citizenship" grade as being truly average, and discussed each student individually before coming to consensus.

We all recognized that some kids and parents would be shocked at their 1st marking period grades, but figured advisors could guide everybody through it and then our new standards would becoem a given. This does seem to have happened. There was an assumption that all this would lead to individual teacher grades reflecting this discussion -- whether this is true or not I can't say. Personally, I give such weight to class participation and homework that it is not all that difficult to get a solid grade in my class if you put out steady effort.

Take care,

Bill Ivey

==================================

Bill Ivey also responded to a comment by Ellen Berg:

Ellen Berg wrote: "If we are truly looking to educate our students and build their esteem legitimately (as well as offer them the support they need), students should be moved along according to mastery of essential concepts. (...) I realize this is a difficult proposition, but there has to be a better way to ensure all our children learn what they need to learn. What do you all think?"

Hi!

I love this idea in theory, and actually know a school where this is done and where it works. My son is enrolled in a small (30 kids) elementary school which operates along these lines. Not only do these kids learn what they need to learn (quite often, much more than the traditional elementary school curriculum), but also they leave the school with a deep love of learning and deep faith in themselves that they can learn. It's a beautiful thing to see.

Translating their practices to middle school French classes, however, leaves me feeling more than a little daunted. Learning theory tells me I have to provide comprehensible input which is just above the students' level, and figuring out a way to do that for kids working on a vast array of vocabulary and grammar, not to mention scheduling issues (how do you determine groupings, what if a student needs to switch groups mid-year, etc.), is extremely difficult.

I could use the "Turning Points 2000" model and work from the ACTFL standards to design a curriculum, rethink ways to assess students' progress toward these standards, then find and design a series of communication activites, readings, etc. which can work for kids at differing levels within a specific group, and try to move toward the kind of ideal teaching Ellen is talking about. The first two steps are not that difficult, and in fact I hope to accomplish these eventually. But that final step - where on earth do I find the time to do all that?!

I do think this all would be easier to do in other subjects, including music (which I also teach). And I'm sort of hoping someone will kick me and tell me I'm way too pessimistic...

Anyway, back to my preps!

Bill Ivey
French and Music teacher

==================================

Deborah Bambino responded to Bill:

Bill Ivey wrote: "I do think this all would be easier to do in other subjects, including music (which I also teach). And I'm sort of hoping someone will kick me and tell me I'm way too pessimistic..."

Hi Bill, I don't think it's a kick you need, but I do think you need a team or a critical friend. When you outline what you could/should do, it seems enormous, if you are contemplating doing it alone. Having others to collaborate with could make all the difference for you and the kids.

Do you teach French & Music to the same kids? Are you able to merge disciplines at all? Just wondering...I have fond memories of singing French songs in school.

Deb

==================================

Betsy Burch wrote:

I think when I asked my fairly brief questions of Tony and Gayle, what I was thinking about is what Anne Jolly has described so well. Because my teachers are not "teamed" and there has been a great deal of resistence to this idea over the past years at my school, I felt strongly that we need to start somewhere that establishes a comfort zone for beginning the collaboration process.

So, when I was asked as the principal to design a new schedule for a potential school calendar change (off of Year round and onto Traditional) I worked out a way that our departments all had common prep periods. The teachers loved the idea that they had the freedom to meet daily if they wanted.

In addition to this level of collaboration, I also included in the plan a "Common Planning" time every other week for the whole faculty. This would be a day on which the students would arrive two hours late in the morning. This time would be used for offering the teachers staff dev. training on looking at student work. I included the notion that the study/looking at... groups could be both department groups at the beginning, and then move to interdisciplinary groups as the teachers had the time to practice and become more comfortable with the process of examining student work. Again, the teachers agreed that this was a good way to start.

Hopefully, in the next year or so, we will be able to actually try this plan! Since this is part of the booklist discussion, what do you all think about this as a transition plan to begin to move teachers from non-collaboration to collaboration? Thanks for your thoughts!

Betsy

==================================

Turning Points co-author Tony Jackson arrived and worked to catch up on the conversation:

Hi Everyone:

This is Tony Jackson, jumping in the conversation a bit late due to some unexpected travel that I had to complete. I've had a chance to read all the e-mails and I think I would like to make a few comments rather than try at this stage to respond to individual questions.

The conversation on where to start is very interesting, and Gayle's response, as always, was right on the money. What I would add, though, is that we have to be careful with the very notion of "starting" when it comes to improving schools for young adolescents.

You may notice that we very rarely use the words "Turning Points model" and tend to shy away from the word "reform" as well. The point is, what we've tried to present in Turning Points 2000 is our best understanding of good practice in all aspects of middle grades school life, rather that a model of reform.

A reform model, on the one hand, implies that a school and the kids and adults in it are in some significant way deviant and in need of correction (i.e. "reform schools") and, on the other hand, that after implementation of a model, a reformed school has finished its work.

I'm hopefully not being too esoteric (that can happen, when one moves to California as I have recently), but what I am trying to convey is that if there is really a starting point in improving middle grades schools it is in our way of thinking about every aspect of what goes on in that school, with questions in mind such as "why do we do this in this way?" and "is this practice leading to improved learning and developmental outcomes for my kids and how would I know it if it did?

Continuous improvement (as opposed to the implementation of a model) is first of all a mindset with regard to everyday practices. So, the development of a comprehensive assessment of where the school is and where it needs to go is essential, but it is part of a broader reorientation to doing the work in middle grades school on a day to day basis.

This is a lengthy preamble to another thought, which is that regardless to where you are in an overall planning process, teachers and administrators in middle grades schools need to SOON get to looking at student work as part of the everyday process in middle grades schools.

I am convinced that the deepest insights leading to improvement of student learning in middle grades schools are to be had through careful, consistent and COLLABORATIVE analysis of student work. And every effort needs to be made, as already noted in the conversation, to keep looking-at-student-work opportunities from becoming gripe sessions.

As noted in the book, there are good protocols that can structure this kind of educator-led professional development. But what's also usually called for is one or a few courageous teachers to take the initial step by volunteering to have their students' work looked at by a group of critical friends. It is also very important to analyze the assignment given by the teacher that lead to the student work being analyzed and there protocols available to analyze the quality of teacher's assignments just as there are protocols to analyze the quality of student work.

I've touched on the need for collaborative analysis of student work; I want to use that to support what's also been said in this conversation regarding the need to develop a collaborative culture in middle grades schools generally.

I can't think of a middle grades school, or any school for that matter, that is really meeting its students' needs wherein the teachers are not working collaboratively to a significant degree. My sentence structure may not be the best, but you get my meaning.

It is often difficult to find the time for teachers to regularly come together, but I can't stress enough how important it is to try very hard to find that time. In that activities is how the issue is framed.

Too often, I think, a request for time (or for lots of other important resources) is framed as what we (teachers) need to be able to do our work well. We make a compelling case which we think is convincing only to have the intended audience reject it. One reason this happens is that we have not considered what the interests of the person or group that we are speaking to are that would be well served if the request for planning time for teachers were granted. To put it more crassly, we have to think about and have a good answer to the question "what's in it for me?"

If improving test scores is foremost on the mind of the local school board, how is common planning time going to contribute to that happening? I'm not talking about making false promises, rather trying to hook into what some organizational psychologists call the "occurring world" of the person to whom you are speaking. How is what I am suggesting going to help this person in their life, as well as help me in mine? Just something to consider.

I hope some of this stimulates further questions and comments.

Tony Jackson

==================================

Anne Jolly replied:

Tony, your point is well-taken with regard to having to craft an answer to the question, "What's in it for me?" when asking various audiences for the time and resources for teacher collaboration. Interestingly, one of the first audiences who must be convinced is teachers themselves, and that can be tough.

Many teachers believe that they are already meeting kids' needs by continuing to do things the way they have always done them. They view themselves as already successful teachers. They see no need to change their practice.

Many teachers are so stressed just trying to "hang in there" that the difficult job of changing their practice seems too much to tackle.

Many teachers are a "hard sell" because they've seen so many initiatives come and go that haven't made a difference. That's where teacher leaders - those you describe as "a few courageous teachers [who] take the initial step by volunteering to have their students' work looked at by a group of critical friends" become so important. They are the energetic tugboats who can turn the barges around. (Note that "barges" is not a derogatory analogy. Barges are steady and consistently carry a heavy load. Because of that, it's hard for them to change direction. Once they turn around, however - wow! They're doggedly on target.)

I hope that you, Gayle, or some of our other booklist participants have some ideas for bringing teachers aboard.

Anne

==================================

Tony Jackson answered:

Anne:

I think the principle I noted before with regard to capturing the interest of administrators, parents, etc. applies to teachers as well. Teachers are both as altruistic and self interested as anyone else, so something to consider is, again, identifying what are the specific issues they are grappling with and short term goals they have that time spent in a session on looking at student work, for example, would help them to achieve. In other words, breaking the big goal of long term improvement in student learning into practical and visible objectives that have relevance in the here and now.

What have other folks done to motivate initially recalcitrant colleagues toward positive action?

Tony Jackson

==================================

To which Naomi Smith replied:

How to motivate "recalcitrant colleagues"? This is always hard. One thing I have done is to make it pleasant to do positive things. For instance, "Come to our volunteer study group, have some snacks, get a free book, etc." Or "Oh, you'd like to set up a student centered classroom? What books and supplies do you need?" Then you have a small group doing wonderful things. Others observe and want to be part of it.

Little by little it becomes the norm. Then we have less "recalcitrants". There are some that just seem not to budge. But if you look really closely, they have even moved a little. It takes lots of time and lots of frustration.

Naomi, NYC

==================================

Deb Bambino commented on Tony Jackson's first message:

Tony, I like your emphasis on the process as opposed to a set model. I agree that collaboration is the key to real change and I understand your point about reform, but I don't agree with it.

While I am not interested in playing a "blame game" about this or that group of teachers, I do think we need to openly recognize that our system is deficient. I could climb on my soap box to vent about the political underpinnings of the deficiency, but I have homework to do, so I'll spare you. In any case, despite our hard work and the best of intentions, we are failing far too many of our children. When we embrace this reality without guilt, but with a renewed sense of collective purpose, I believe we can effect change.

Perhaps an example would help: Our high school was just the site of a violent fight between a handful of Caucasian & African American kids. It was only a handful of kids, but their fight has uncovered some fairly serious intolerance and discrimination. Whole groups of well meaning teachers want it over and want to move on in the same old way. They point to all that is positive in the school and they deny the blatant problems that exist.

I say we acknowledge our weaknesses and trust each other and our strengths to get us over the rough spots. Is this making sense? I have to get back to my homework, but I wanted to respond.

Deb

==================================

Betsy Burch wrote:

Deborah, and Tony and Gayle, too! Deb's comment that "whole groups of well-meaning teachers want it over and want to move on in the same old way" struck a strong chord with me.

As most of you have figured out, I am right smack dab in the middle of living the well-examined life of an underperforming school principal - and when our External Evaluator conducted the interviews with our teachers, a number of them came to me and said that they had not been given enough time to tell the evaluator the "whole story of our school".

When I asked what they felt were important points that had been left out, in their perception, the responses were primarily a complaint that they had not been able to tell the evaluator what a great staff and school we really are!

When I mentioned this perception to the evaluator in a later conversation, her reply was, "we are after data, not feel-good observations...". Needless to say, this also got me thinking! And I realized that my teachers were feeling very invaded and threatened by this whole data collection process, mostly because they have not been asked questions like this with any frequency, and they also were putting their bid in to keep things the same!

So, Deborah, the question for me, for many of us, is how do we begin the movement in thinking for all of those "well-meaning teachers" who are probably a majority on most of our faculties? One small experience I had in my school last year offered a glimmer of what can happen when teachers are working together.

We are required in my district to give pre-post assessments in the areas of reading, math and writing. The Language Arts teachers had been required to correct the pre-reading tests early in the year and were complaining, legitimately, that it was a very time-consuming process that no other teachers were required to do. So, I decided to have each of my tracks (our year round calendar produces three tracks of 10 teachers each) to share in the correction process for their own students. About half way through the first of the "corrrecting parties", a number of interesting comments began to surface.

First, one of the PE teachers said, as he finished correcting a reading test with a very low score, "...no wonder he can't pass my rules test in PE...". Then, another teacher, also correcting a low score test, said, "...but this student has always earned A's in my class and has been on the Honor Roll for two years...". At that point, for a few minutes in time, those 10 teachers, not all of them happy about my requirement that we all share in the correction process, (yes, I was correcting tests right along with them!), experienced a shared view of how the students on their track were doing, and how the skills or lack of them, was a common concern and responsibility.

Since that experience, some of the teachers have begun to talk about how every department can contribute to our kids success by working on skill-building in areas such as reading. And, a few are in agreement that time spent together talking about how we meet the kids needs is something we need to do. Needless to say, I hope to capitalize on this one small window of understanding. My point is, that sometimes when we force our faculties to "start somewhere" positive forward movement does happen. Any other baby-step experiences out there this morning?

Betsy

==================================

South Carolina principal Susan Fedor wrote about middle grades teacher preparation:

As a principal ready to go in and negotiate staffing for the upcoming year, the issue of finding the best teachers for the middle grades is at the top of my priority list. Recruitment and interviewing will start next month for the 2001-2002 school year.

I interview the most promising of the current crop (seeking generic qualities of good teachers); our district gets favored status from most teachers looking for positions. In my entire experience, I have never interviewed a new teacher with the preservice preparation described on pages 96 and 99. However, I have a strong staff overall.

As an aside: I am a latecomer to the belief in the necessity of a teacher's having a deep content background. But am a true believer now, working with both secondary and elementary trained teachers and seeing the advantage of those secondary teachers who "know what they know," compared to the elementary who know what the teacher's manual has told them. It is a striking comparison.

If the imperative for middle school change is at the door with no time to waste, where are these teachers to come from with the preparation programs currently in place? What about certification: two areas?

TP 2000 mentions that Turning Points said "growing our own" was a second rate option, but I have experienced no alternative. We get the best and brightest, we expect additional coursework in the area(s) they teach within five years of hiring, and eventually have the teacher we were looking for. Strong middle school culture shapes the teachers these newcomers become. But, getting them already prepared would certainly jump-start the process of bringing them into a culture of collaboration, standards based instruction, and reflective practice.

Given our public image, sorry to relate, I have great difficulty imagining the day when a young person enters an education prep program with a burning desire to be a middle school teacher. And yet there are those teachers you just know when you meet them will be great middle school teachers. Those perfect candidates for the middle school are out there. So, I see attracting bright, well- trained teachers to the middle school as a cornerstone of the proposals in Turning Points 2000.

The hurdles to developing a deep pool of such applicants are high. What will help colleges and universities understand about teacher preparation? They have their own battles to fight and it seems, their battles are not ours. How do we share the vision with those who are designing preservice and how do we make the prospect of middle school teaching an attractive one?
PDS's are promising but not sufficient for tying teacher training to schools.

I am Susan Fedor, principal of a sixth grade school of 1,000 plus in Columbia, South Carolina. I have had the licensure and training conversation with a personnel officer in a nearby rural district who maintains that the whole discussion is useless to him so dire is the teacher shortage he confronts every day in a district with no particular allure for prospective teachers. He finds the whole issue irrelevant.

I understand his perspective but still maintain that the recruitment, training of teachers for the middle school is a prime consideration in creating the middle schools we know we should have.

Susan

==================================

Bill Ivey wrote:

Deborah Bambino wrote: "I say we acknowledge our weaknesses and trust each other and our strengths to get us over the rough spots. Is this making sense?"

and

Tony Jackson wrote: "Continuous improvement (as opposed to the implementation of a model) is first of all a mindset with regard to everyday practices."

Hi!

What Deb said makes a ton of sense. There is a line in "The Headmaster's Papers" where Richard Hawley's title character observes in essence that all schools have problems and crises, what makes a school great is how they deal with these. Collaboration, as Tony said so well, has got to be part of the solution.

While I'm on the subject, Betsy's plan to move her staff toward collaboration sounds promising, given, as Naomi said, that some people can be moved faster than others.

I agree with Tony that it is imperative that teams of teachers look at student work together, and I plan to find some way to suggest that to our Upper School Head. Fortunately, he is most always willing to listen and consider new ideas, and equally fortunately, he has managed (though only in his first year in this position) to create a strong climate of true collaboration, so the context is there.

As a French/Music teacher, though, I am acutely aware that examining student work brings different positive ends to different disciplines. "Turning Points 2000" helped me see more concretely how certain big picture concepts (e.g. pattern recognition) can be written up as standards which might affect my own disciplines as well as the "core" subjects of English/History/Math/Science.

But much of what I teach, and many of the standards I am working to meet, are very specific to my disciplines. How does one go about ensuring this evaluation of student work is more or less equally valuable to all teachers, or are most of you imagining a team which involves only the "Big Four" disciplines?

Bill

==================================


Bill Ivey also responded to comments made to him by Deb:

Deb Bambino wrote: "I don't think it's a kick you need, but I do think you need a team or a critical friend. When you outline what you could/should do, it seems enormous, if you are contemplating doing it alone. Having others to collaborate with could make all the difference for you and the kids."

There's that "collaboration" word again! The amount of work necessary to completely redesign a French curriculum with multi-level comprehensible input in mind does become more manageable if the work is split up among many people. Well.. the trick for me would be, where does this team come from? I am the only 6-9 French teacher in my school, and my part of Massachusetts is rural enough that people would have to be willing to drive a fair distance to put a multi-school team together.

It would take some luck and a lot of time just to put the team together, never mind complete the project. But then, if it did happen, what a thing it would be!

Fortunately, the critical friend part of your suggestion is easy, as my wife is one of the most gifted French teachers I have ever seen, and teaches at my old high school. But we don't teach any levels in common, so it would be hard to ask her to help me with this project. Anyway, thanks for giving me hope without a kick!

Take care,

Bill Ivey

==================================

Betsy Burch commented on teacher preparation:

Susan Fedor described another of my soapboxes so well when she took up the subject of middle grades teacher preparation.

So, to Tony and Gayle: how can we involve the universities and state teacher credential commissions in this much needed discussion of developing and requiring a middle school credential? I struggle annually with exactly what Susan describes. In California it is especially frustrating, because we must hire either single subject or multiple subject candidates, neither of which "fit" a middle school program.

So, after I hire the best I can find from the very slim pickings, I must tell them they will have to earn supplementary certificates. Not a great piece of news for a new hire, strapped with college loans, trying to master the art of middle school discipline, etc.

I teach a middle school curriculum course as an elective at a local university and am told by my students that middle school teaching is not a priority. As evidence, my course is only offered every other year, as an elective! I often wonder what the power of our listserv, knowing the national connections that are made here, could do about this very important area that is so critical to the continued growth of the middle school movement.

How could we influence commissions and schools of education to recognize the critical importance of establishing credentials designed to train middle school teachers? I really believe that until a middle school credential becomes a requirement at the state level, we will continue to struggle with finding new teachers willing to try middle school and this fact alone, slows the development of effective middle schools. What do the rest of you think?

Betsy

==================================

Ellen Berg replied:

In the state of Missouri, if you want to teach middle school, you must now have middle school certification from an accredited university. I believe (?) this became mandatory in 1994 or 1996 (I can't remember exactly), but all of us who were certified under the old plan--secondary or elementary--can still teach in the middle schools.

As a secondary certified teacher, I really see the gaps in my education in terms of how to educate adolescents. I am not sure what the actual certification program entails, but I would imagine it would provide a lot more training on teaching students how to read rather than simply comprehension and analytical strategies.

It has been a struggle for me to work with my 1st and 2nd grade level readers in the 6th grade! In terms of their peculiarities as adolescents, I have been lucky to really understand their trials, tribulations, and quirks. I'm a pretty quirky person myself, and I still remember the highs and lows of being that age. It also helps that with my secondary training they included some investigation of the adolescent stage of development.

I wasn't aware that many states did not have middle school certification. I've always thought of Missouri as being conservative and backwards when it came to those issues, so I'm kind of surprised. I'd be interested to know which states do and do not have certification for the middle school years.

I know when I was going through college people were expected to either be elementary or high school teachers; little was said by students or faculty about teaching middle school. Middle school was the great unknown to me when I impulsively switched my request to a middle school student teaching assignment from a high school assignment.

Unfortunately many incoming teachers know little about middle level teaching beyond the stereotypes of adolescents. There needs to be more work placing prospective teachers in all levels for observations. In my case, my interest was piqued after two observation assignments in middle schools.

How did the rest of you end up in middle level education? Choice? Accident?

Ellen Berg

==========================================

Amy Heinsma responded:

Ellen - I attended the University of Northern Colorado in Greeley, Colorado where I got my degree in English with an Emphasis in Middle School Education. My licensure is Middle School English. I chose to be a middle school teacher, but still feel quite unprepared for the complexities of teaching this age group.

Amy Heinsma
7th Language Arts & Reading

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Marsha Ratzel had this to say about teacher preparation:

I planned on being a sixth grade teacher in an elementary building. Did all my student teaching there, etc. Well, when I interviewed in a district where I had no chance of getting hired, the principal who was on interviewing duty that day and I just clicked. Our district has a programmed interview and I just sort of refused to "play" and took over the interview. That made an instant bond between us because she was a sort of rebel in the middle school movement in my district.

She told me she was changing my job application from elementary(k-5) to middle school and didn't care what I thought about it. Then she sent me straight over to see her assistant principal. When she rejoined us, they asked me what I wanted to teach and I replied social studies or communications. Wrong answer, they said. Science was the best place for me. No way, I said because I hated science. All the better they said.

Eight years later I'm still a science teacher and love it. I think it's been more than OK. I understand why kids hate science and have strived not to replicate those negative experiences. I've had to teach myself a ton of content, but who cares. I'm always ahead of the kids, have found so many educated helpful colleagues, and I'm not afraid to tell them I don't know, but I know how to find out. Then we go and find out together. The inquiry process is terrific and the principals were right. It's a match made in heaven---my flip personality and curiosity matches perfectly with middle school kids and science.

Now guess what they told me last year---you'd be a perfect math teacher, too. No, I said. I'm a math teacher now and I love it too. Even though I was a math major in college, I hated math. It was so dull and boring. But not anymore--long gone are the straight rows and thousands of worksheets. Thank goodness our math program is discovery and constructivist oriented. All the science tools work in beautifully. And math and science are a great integration.

I never aspired to be a middle school teacher. But I wouldn't wish for any other job right now. I'm sure glad others knew exactly what I was cut out to be because I sure didn't.

Marsha

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Nancy Long had this to say about the conversation regarding "recalcitrant colleagues":

Naomi Smith wrote about coaxing her colleagues into becoming more involved. I like Naomi's way, but another tack has been used at our campus.That would be the "drag them in kicking and screaming" approach. Believe it or not, it is working -- at least to some degree.

We have mandatory, high-quality inservice training on what the administrators decide we need to improve (e.g., promoting literacy in all subject areas). Then the principals do walk-throughs, pad in hand, to check for what they expect to see happening to promote literacy. Written feedback is given afterward, and if one doesn't "pass muster" one has a private conversation with the administrator. That goes a long way toward increasing teachers' level of concern!

Recently we had training in the Standards in Practice model of looking at student work. Now, in our monthly department meetings, we go through the process with work submitted by one teacher, with an administrator sitting in. After several months of doing it, we all see the relevance and benefit of the process and appreciate our colleagues' feedback.

The way I know mandatory participation in the "new and improved" methodologies is having a positive effect on the staff is that we are getting much better reports from outside evaluators than we did two or three years ago. We are all moving up to a higher standard of accountability.

As Naomi said, the nurturing is vital, but we teachers tend to do it for each other; that part (sadly) is not a top-down action in our school. We really watch out for each other and help each other recognize gaps and fill them in before an administrator has to call them to our attention. It's not that the administrators are unwilling, they are just very busy people.

Guess it's still true that there is more than one way to skin a cat!

Nancy Long

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Anne Jolly brought the group's attention back to TP2000's "core values":

I love the core values set forth in Turning Points 2000. To paraphrase slightly - The main purpose of middle grades education is to promote adolescents' intellectual development, enable every student to think creatively, enable each one to identify and solve problems, communicate and work well with others, and develop the needed base of factual knowledge and skills.

Intertwined in that are high expectations for student success and the need to help students tread across the emotionally-laden "mindfields" they encounter as they change from children to adults. What a wonderful backdrop against which to engage in daily planning for teaching and learning!

Since those of us on this booklist are also on the MiddleWeb listserv, I wonder if any of you saw the job description John Norton posted:

"Standard & Poor's is accepting applications on an ongoing basis for people to help them provide 'web-based analytical and decision-making tools for public policy professionals, elected officials, administrators, and voters.' Requirements for applicants? 'Should have experience in performance measurement, financial analysis, statistics, economics of education, policy analysis, quantitative research, institutional effectiveness, or educational administration.'"